View Full Version : UFC 97 preview is up - "Shogun had some of the best muay thai in mma"
Aaron
03-23-2009, 02:45 PM
http://www.ufc.com/
i literally LOL'd when i heard that....what a joke....i'm so sick of these guys like thiago silva, shogun, and wilson gouevaia who the UFC promotes as "thai fighters"....have they ever actually watched muay thai? these guys have a wild, brawling style with kicks and sometimes use the thai clinch....that doesn't mean they have good muay thai
RileyTP17
03-23-2009, 03:08 PM
Yeah agreed. Shogun had a great clinch game, unfortunately there is more to being a great technical mauy thai fighter. But it worked for him in the past, I still hope he can get to that level again, but he is going to have to sharpen up his technique a lot to do that I think. There are just too many good strikers at 205 now.
ThatGuyJae
03-23-2009, 03:15 PM
Have to agree, he uses the clinch pretty well but that does not mean his Muay Thai is some of the best in the world. So much more goes into having great Muay Thai
I've got serious man love for Shogun but there's no way he has a good technical muay thai game.
He's got a pretty good clinch and really nice leg kicks but his boxing itself is actually pretty poor, he's always had sloppy hands and was able to mask it just with pure agression but with his conditioning in the state it is now it really shows up the holes in his standup game IMO.
ThatGuyJae
03-23-2009, 03:40 PM
I've got serious man love for Shogun but there's no way he has a good technical muay thai game.
He's got a pretty good clinch and really nice leg kicks but his boxing itself is actually pretty poor, he's always had sloppy hands and was able to mask it just with pure agression but with his conditioning in the state it is now it really shows up the holes in his standup game IMO.
Well put def agree. He has aspects of his Muay Thai game that are good but overall he is not a great Muay Thai fighter.
He's got a pretty good clinch and really nice leg kicks but his boxing itself is actually pretty poor, he's always had sloppy hands and was able to mask it just with pure agression but with his conditioning in the state it is now it really shows up the holes in his standup game IMO.
This is exactly the case! He has always been sloppy and so far that hasnt worked too well in the UFC. I hope his new camp gets him in shape but we will see.
Sewaside
03-23-2009, 04:45 PM
This is exactly the case! He has always been sloppy and so far that hasnt worked too well in the UFC. I hope his new camp gets him in shape but we will see.
I'm sick of the damn excuses... Every fight is the next fight we'll see the REAL Shogun. It's a wrap for dude far as ever being a top guy at 205
Have you even seen the 05 MWGP?
Cos if you have then that's a bold statement and if you haven't then it's a silly one IMO.
Shogun hasn't looked great lately and I don't know if he'll ever find his 05 form again after the knee injuries he's had, but to say it's definitely over for someone who showed that much potential based on two shitty performances is being way too quick ti judge IMO.
Aaron
03-23-2009, 04:55 PM
Have you even seen the 05 MWGP?
Cos if you have then that's a bold statement and if you haven't then it's a silly one IMO.
Shogun hasn't looked great lately and I don't know if he'll ever find his 05 form again after the knee injuries he's had, but to say it's definitely over for someone who showed that much potential based on two shitty performances is being way too quick ti judge IMO.
many times....he was a wild, brawler then with kicks....cept he had a crazy gas tank....
his striking technique was always pretty bad...it's just starting to get exposed now
bbjd7
03-23-2009, 05:03 PM
Yea Shogun doesn't have great Muay Thai and I love Shogun but this is nothing new for the UFC.
Babalu was being called an amazing Muay Thai striker when he fought Travis Wiuff.
Shogun has Some Muay Thai skills I mean he did compete in Muay Thai but he's not nearly one of the best in the world or in MMA.
And anyone who thought Thiago Silva was a Muay Thai fighter hasn't been paying attention.
Yeah his cardio was a huge part of his game, not only did it aid his aggressiveness which helped hide/protect the flaws in his striking like his fundamental boxing and complete lack of head movement but it also made his recovery time (which I think is pretty good naturally) just insane so that when he did get caught he was rarely in trouble for long.
I think one thing that's made Shogun look worse in the UFC is his two opponents. Although people know Shogun for his wild standup he used to really like taking people down a lot and won several fights on the ground just like the Lil Nog one.
In Forrest and Coleman he's faced two opponents who make it really hard to impose his groundgame cos Forrest's got a pretty tight jitz game himself and Coleman, while he is old and broken down, is still gonna be pretty hard to get to the mat. Of course none of that matters if his cardio doesn't improve, it actually looked worse against Coleman.
I think if Shogun can get his cardio back to the level it was before he can be a legit top 5-10 LHW without ever really challenging. To really compete with the UFC's best and get in realistic title contention I think he's got to fix the fundamental flaws in his striking game that are, most importantly, his head movement and also his all round boxing game.
ThatGuyJae
03-23-2009, 05:25 PM
I agree his cardio is hurting him more than anything. I just have to wonder if he can ever get his cardio back to where it was after all the knee problems. We will see though.
PirateNinja415
03-23-2009, 05:31 PM
yea, i agree that shogun's striking is very sloppy at times and that his weak cardio exposed this even more so. if he can get his gas tank back i think he'll be able to compete with the top 5 in the lhw division
southpaw447
03-23-2009, 05:52 PM
http://www.ufc.com/
i literally LOL'd when i heard that....what a joke....i'm so sick of these guys like thiago silva, shogun, and wilson gouevaia who the UFC promotes as "thai fighters"....have they ever actually watched muay thai? these guys have a wild, brawling style with kicks and sometimes use the thai clinch....that doesn't mean they have good muay thai
There are very few fighters with traditional Muay Thai that compete in MMA.
I tend to agree somewhat with that statement made here he may not have great MT when you look at guys like Buakaw or Dekkers but in MMA there aren't many guys that have a really solid traditional Muay Thai background.
BTW, how else are the supposed to hype the fight?
BTW, how else are the supposed to hype the fight?
Yeah what do you want them to say?
A sub par striker with bad cardio fights the greatest UFC champ ever who looks like his career is winding down and has gotten worked in 3 of his last 4 fights. Now pay us 50 bucks to watch that. :D
In all seriousness though I started laughing when in the commercial they said the two of the best strikers in MMA go at it.
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